masturbate vs looking at porn

[Some1Else]

if i have to chose between breaking one of two habits, should it be masterbadting or looking at porn

[kiyara]

well id say stop mastuyrbating b/c thasts the real issur

[Comfortably Dumb]

Why break the habit in the first place? I'd rather masturbate than impregnate someone.

[whuknu]

Well im not some1else so i cant say for him- but....i can say that sometimes ppl jsut like to drop habits-for example (i know its gross) i bite my nails- and i would love to stop doing that- so yeh maybe he just wants to quit something he doesnt feel is good (please, some1else, correct me if im wrong)

[Blink]

wel if u stop porn, u cut off alot of the urge to masterbate. porn is usually the reason for it,s o stop it at the source.

[Comfortably Dumb]

Porn isn't the source of your sexual drive. Your raging hormones are. I don't get what's so wrong about pornography or masturbation.

[whuknu]

well if its bc of halacha (which u dont have to agree w/ but some1else might (or might not)), like kiyara sed, masturbating is issur. and while raging hormones may be the reason for one's sexual drive, watching porn may increase it and cause one to be more careless and so on

[Comfortably Dumb]

So? Are you going to Hell because of it? Is there anything wrong with pleasuring yourself? All the Doctors say it's healthy.

[israeliwannabe]

i think that eventually u should try and stop both. however i know that its really hard to change everything at once. if ur gonna stop just one thing, i agree w/kiyara. it's issur. even if u still look at porn (which isn't gr8), at least ur not doing an aveira.

[PrUnE]

if i have to chose between breaking one of two habits, should it be masterbadting or looking at pornstop looking at the porn, because eventually you will have nothing to masterbate to, and will end up doing neither.

[Comfortably Dumb]

Is anyone listening to me here?! Hello?! YOU DON'T NEED PORN TO MASTURBATE!

[whuknu]

ok ok! but maybe w/o the porn (MAYBE) hed be less likely to masterbate.

[Comfortably Dumb]

No. It's only normal for a Teenage to masturbate. People did it way before pornography was introduced. You just use your imagination.

[PrUnE]

Is anyone listening to me here?! Hello?! YOU DON'T NEED PORN TO MASTURBATE!I dont know about u, but i do

[PrUnE]

also if u look at porn, u might masterbate, what am i talkin about mite, u will, u cant keep lookin at porn for over a month and not masterbate, cause u will get so horny, that ur just gonna lose ur sense of mind and masterbate, if u dont look at porn u will do it less and less, u will never fully stop, until ur like married, but still u will do it alot less.

[Blink]

i think that eventually u should try and stop both. however i know that its really hard to change everything at once. if ur gonna stop just one thing, i agree w/kiyara. it's issur. even if u still look at porn (which isn't gr8), at least ur not doing an aveira.

porn is actually an aveira, but not as bad. u shud see wut the mishna b'rurah says on the topic of looking at women and wut kiztur shulchan aruch says on masterbation. actually scary.

[whuknu]

thats what i was trying to say, thank u prune

[PrUnE]

thats what i was trying to say, thank u pruneno problem, i see that you and I, agree on most topics

[Comfortably Dumb]

All of our Sages, Forefathers, etc. have masturbated.

[whuknu]

not that im arguing cuz i honestly dk- but what source did u find that sez that?

[Comfortably Dumb]

The dictionary.

Masturbation(n)-Manual stimulation of the genital organs.

I'm pretty sure Abraham had to manually stimulate his penis once in a while. How else would he go to the bathroom?

[whuknu]

well theres a diference btwn going to the bathroom and masturbating for pleasure? is there not?

[Comfortably Dumb]

No. You're still manually stimulating your penis.

[whuknu]

but not for the purpose of pleasure- simply for the purpose of performing a bodily function one must do right?

[Comfortably Dumb]

Dude, I already explained the definition ofmasturbation. It does not have to be for any sexual pleasure.

[whuknu]

ok well i think that the issur against masturbation is applied to sexual pleasure- obviosly if u have to pee, u have to do what u have to do- God created man to have to go the way he does so He is probably ok with stimulating as long as its for going to the bathroom, not sexual pleasure.

[CptCatz]

so why would god be ok with stimulating as long as its to pee but not for sexual pleasure? whats the differance?

[whuknu]

well im not a rabbi obviously, and i dont know the exact exact reasons for the issur of not being alowed to derive sexual pleasure from masturbating (or whtvr u get the point) but if thats what one has to do in order to pee, im sure its ok. These things make me happy im a girl. ;)

[PrUnE]

so why would god be ok with stimulating as long as its to pee but not for sexual pleasure? whats the differance?Well, who cares cause he doesn't exist.

[teen16]

man, this convo has gone from cool to rediculous.

first of all, comf-dumb, u fial to give the full definition of masturbation, as u def knew. for all concerned, here they are:

**************************
American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.

mas·tur·ba·tion n. Excitation of one's own or another's genital organs, usually to orgasm, by manual contact or means other than sexual intercourse.The

**************************
The American Heritage Stedman's Medical Dictionary
Copyright 2002, 2001, 1995 by Houghton Mifflin Company.

mas·tur·ba·tion n. Excitation of one's own or another's genital organs, usually to orgasm, by manual contact or means other than sexual intercourse.

**************************
Merriam-Webster Medical Dictionary
Copyright 2002 Merriam-Webster, Inc.

Main Entry: mas·tur·ba·tion
Pronunciation: "mas-t&r-'bA-sh&n
Function: noun
erotic stimulation especially of one's own genital organs commonly resulting in orgasm and achieved by manual or other bodily contact exclusive of sexual intercourse, by instrumental manipulation, occasionally by sexual fantasies, or by various combinations of these agencies called also onanism, self-abuse

**************************
WordNet 2.0, Copyright 2003 Princeton University

masturbation
n : manual stimulation of the genital organs (of yourself or another) for sexual pleasure

**************************


Now, the first point is that mastubation, as we all know anyway, is always about sexual pleasure -- the part of the definition conveniently left out by CN. i dont know what dictionary he uses, but all the major ones are up there so lets just mover right passed the definition angle here. also, unless you have some problem pissing, i don't know any1 who has to stimulate themselves in any way to pee. so my point to CN is, first - don't attack a sacred caracter like avraham in a totally unrelated sexual discussion like this just for shock value and then try to justify it with half-definitions that any monkey knows is not true. if u don't want to respect the convos here then don't - but u are dissing all of us with bogus posts like that - and frankly some of ur other posts in other areas are much more challenging to think about.


next - prune - we already know u dont believe in God -- we get it. but that discussion is going on on the religion boards. this site is a community where religious jewish teens discuss issues. obviously for some of us God is a factor in our sex-life (or lack thereof) decission making. we respect ur religious doubts. but if u wanna help us here u should respect wear we're coming from to.

finally - where did any1 geet an idea that God forbids sexual pleasure??? hello- sex is a mitzvah in our religion!! masturbation is a sin because sperm is sacred as a life-source -- thus the dif in laws for guys and girls -- check out earlier discussions on masturbation if ur curious about all that.


i realize i don't post alot, so it'll probably piss some people off that i just pop in here and start ripping it. but like a lot of teens out there like me read these boards all the time, and the cred of things here matters to us. u guys speak for a lot of us -- keep it real

[whuknu]

I dont think any one meant that sexual pleasure is a sin- i realized now that i might have implied that- i understand that it is a mitzvah- what i meant was what u sed about boys not being allowed to masturbate....

[Comfortably Dumb]

Your definitions are out-dated.

[PrUnE]

man, this convo has gone from cool to rediculous.

first of all, comf-dumb, u fial to give the full definition of masturbation, as u def knew. for all concerned, here they are:

**************************
American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.

mas·tur·ba·tion n. Excitation of one's own or another's genital organs, usually to orgasm, by manual contact or means other than sexual intercourse.The

**************************
The American Heritage Stedman's Medical Dictionary
Copyright 2002, 2001, 1995 by Houghton Mifflin Company.

mas·tur·ba·tion n. Excitation of one's own or another's genital organs, usually to orgasm, by manual contact or means other than sexual intercourse.

**************************
Merriam-Webster Medical Dictionary
Copyright 2002 Merriam-Webster, Inc.

Main Entry: mas·tur·ba·tion
Pronunciation: "mas-t&r-'bA-sh&n
Function: noun
erotic stimulation especially of one's own genital organs commonly resulting in orgasm and achieved by manual or other bodily contact exclusive of sexual intercourse, by instrumental manipulation, occasionally by sexual fantasies, or by various combinations of these agencies called also onanism, self-abuse

**************************
WordNet 2.0, Copyright 2003 Princeton University

masturbation
n : manual stimulation of the genital organs (of yourself or another) for sexual pleasure

**************************


Now, the first point is that mastubation, as we all know anyway, is always about sexual pleasure -- the part of the definition conveniently left out by CN. i dont know what dictionary he uses, but all the major ones are up there so lets just mover right passed the definition angle here. also, unless you have some problem pissing, i don't know any1 who has to stimulate themselves in any way to pee. so my point to CN is, first - don't attack a sacred caracter like avraham in a totally unrelated sexual discussion like this just for shock value and then try to justify it with half-definitions that any monkey knows is not true. if u don't want to respect the convos here then don't - but u are dissing all of us with bogus posts like that - and frankly some of ur other posts in other areas are much more challenging to think about.


next - prune - we already know u dont believe in God -- we get it. but that discussion is going on on the religion boards. this site is a community where religious jewish teens discuss issues. obviously for some of us God is a factor in our sex-life (or lack thereof) decission making. we respect ur religious doubts. but if u wanna help us here u should respect wear we're coming from to.

finally - where did any1 geet an idea that God forbids sexual pleasure??? hello- sex is a mitzvah in our religion!! masturbation is a sin because sperm is sacred as a life-source -- thus the dif in laws for guys and girls -- check out earlier discussions on masturbation if ur curious about all that.


i realize i don't post alot, so it'll probably piss some people off that i just pop in here and start ripping it. but like a lot of teens out there like me read these boards all the time, and the cred of things here matters to us. u guys speak for a lot of us -- keep it realahaha look at u comin in here and thinkin he ripped us off, but u forgat one thing, it says in ur torah, that masterbation is a deadly sin, because u are killin orr sperm which would have been people, obvoiusly u fail to realize that, secondly, god allows us to have sexual pleasures but only sex where a mom and a dad make babies, i dont need to describe that to u do i? so looks like ur still rippin it up huh? next time look up ur torah, and u will see that masterbation is a big sin.

[DeliaDeLyon]

If sex was wrong unless the intent was to make babies then wouldnt it be forbidden for people who are unable to have children to have sex? How about for older women who are no longer physically able to concieve? To the best of my knowledge there is no prohibition against old people having sex.

[PrUnE]

hey, its ok if ur married, just not when ur noit

[whuknu]

so u can also say that from this a woman can also not use birth control pills- but some rabbis say u can and some say u can not. But then if u can then the man is killing of his sperm too- but not necesarily- he is actually having sex and not preventing anyone from makeing a baby- but the woman, who i believe this is not against, is technically getting rid of the sperm (im nto sure exactly how birth control works). But its the woman thats getting rid of it- not the man, but i think for the woman its ok...not sure exactly.

[PrUnE]

so u can also say that from this a woman can also not use birth control pills- but some rabbis say u can and some say u can not. But then if u can then the man is killing of his sperm too- but not necesarily- he is actually having sex and not preventing anyone from makeing a baby- but the woman, who i believe this is not against, is technically getting rid of the sperm (im nto sure exactly how birth control works). But its the woman thats getting rid of it- not the man, but i think for the woman its ok...not sure exactly.its a womans body and she doesnt have to have the child, the man on the other hand is havin nothing in his body.

[whuknu]

exactly what im trying to say

[PrUnE]

exactly what im trying to sayso then whats the problem? (unless u were agreein with me and i just didnt realize)

[whuknu]

i am agreeing with u, i learnt that its not a problem for the woman to get rid of the sperm, just the man, if u think about it, i believe that the mitzvah of reproduction is for the man, its not a mitzvah for a woman, so what the woman does with the sperm (whether she decided to use birth control or whtvr as long as hes not using a condom) its ok. but this is not talking about abortion cuz thats once the babies conceived.

[2face78]

i think that eventually u should try and stop both. however i know that its really hard to change everything at once. if ur gonna stop just one thing, i agree w/kiyara. it's issur. even if u still look at porn (which isn't gr8), at least ur not doing an aveira.
u guys are all wrong
both are issur- porn is issur bc of "Lo Taturu acharai levavchem" in shema-
guys learn ur facts before u talk and to the kid who wants to do one i would go with masterbation because usually the porn will fall to the wayside once the masterbation is gone because there will be nothing to look foward to at the end of watching the porn and u will be less likely to do it after a while,
IM OUT

[PrUnE]

If anythin stop the porn, cause after lookin at porn for a week he is gonna masturbate, no matter how much he says he can control the ruge, hes not, so if anythin he stops the porn cause eventually he is gonna masturbate alot less.

[randomness123]

that's totally tru prune, and exactly what i was going to say. tell me honestly if you can look at porn and not masturbate.. really stopping the porn will probably downsize the masturbation... and once the porn is gone you could work on stopping that, too

[other]

not that im arguing cuz i honestly dk- but what source did u find that sez that?

I know this goes back a ways, but i just read it. Our forfathers did stray off the path and masturbate. At the end of brisheit with Yeuhda and tamar, he did that also.

[whuknu]

i dont remember ever yahving learnt that- he slept with her- i dont think it sez he masterbated.

[PrUnE]

does that make it right? (im playin devils advocate here, i dont think masterbation is wrong).

[2face78]

no where does it say yehuda masterbated? btw do girls find porn gross or not and do they also look?
IM OUT

[whuknu]

personally yeh i think its a little gross so i dont look but i dont really care if someone else does.

[randomness123]

do grls car if their BFs look? would they look with him? wut if it turned him on, but not u?

[baseball guy]

Onan, Yehuda's son was the one who masterbated and he was killed for that. In actuality though, Onan did not necessarily masterbate, some say he had sex but took his penis out right before ejaculation and spilled his seed on the ground. For the etomology ones, the word onanism comes from the biblical Onan, and means either masterbation or taking your penis out right before ejaculation. For the Navi learners, the gemara in sotah 9b or 10a says the way Delilah tortured Samson into telling her the secret to his strength was by slipping out from under him when he was about to finish sex.

[metalhead]

if i have to chose between breaking one of two habits, should it be masterbadting or looking at porn
---
Porn makes you masturbate... honestly, i dont do either... im not THAT desperate... lol jp

[wontsay]

how about masturbating vs. gay sex? which is should a person do?

[whuknu]

i would have to say masterbating bc homosexuality is an abomination according to the Torah

[kiyara]

so is masturbation , whuknu

[whuknu]

ur right- i didnt mean to write it that way. what i meant was he probably is better off masterbating rather then acting on homosexual feelings even though both r an abomination. i would assume its the lesser of the two evil.

[randomness123]

totally masutbattion is beetr than gay sex....masturbation invlovles one person, gay sex=2 ppl, masturbation is something private and able to work on whereas once u enter a homosexual relationship its a lot more difficukt to stop wut uve been doing

[whuknu]

good point that its only one person so its only one person technically doing an aveira also. but if somones been masterbating thats probably also hard to stop just like gay sex. (im just assuming here i wouldnt know)

[randomness123]

im not sure which is harder to stop--gay sex is probably easier, but a gay relationship is not..masturbation is harder to stop but better b/c u do on your own... but in terms of lookin at porn (the topic of this site) dthe easiest way to not is not to start, especiaklly wen it comes to gay b/c it makes u even more guilty and depressed afterwards

[whuknu]

but im assuming once whoever started this thread he was already into porn and masterbating- then how do u stop that is what hes prob asking.

[randomness123]

its just really really hard to do, but be scared that some1 will find u or that all the porn gets viruses on my computer--thats wut stopped me, i mean i know we asked this a long time ago but thats hwo i dealt...definietly stop the porn b4 the masterbation

[whuknu]

randomness i must say it seems like uve come a long way- u seem very strong!

[Reu6922123]

well id say stop mastuyrbating b/c thasts the real issur
The issur for masterbation is a lav (negative commandment). Porn is the lav of Lo Sasuru achrai l'vavchem v'achrai anachem as it says is shmah, also a neg. commandment.

By the way, I take masterbation over porn, for sure!! (Only a person in galus)

[2face78]

wat the hell does that meen only in galus-and for the record its galut not galus- we should be in israel, thats the way they talk there so lets talk like them too.
IM OUT

[lost33]

"By the way, I take masterbation over porn, for sure!! (Only a person in galus)"

Rue6922123 wat r u trying to say???

[Dontknow]

wat the hell does that meen only in galus-and for the record its galut not galus- we should be in israel, thats the way they talk there so lets talk like them too.
IM OUT

2face, i agree that that might be the way we should talk, but everyone has their own opinions and everyone was brought up diferently, so if reu wants to talk that way he is more than welcome to, isnt he? Anyways, even galut we must keep the mitzvot, such as not masterbating, so it doesnt matter galut or not.

[WhoAmI]

DONTKNOW- " even galut we must keep the mitzvot, such as not masterbating"
is that a mitzvah-getting reward for not doing it? or you get a Lav for doing it?

[2face78]

dont know- u missed my point. well, i had 2, u got the first that i prefer galut. but the second part was that his comment was illogical and just didnt make sense.
IM OUT

[Dontknow]

DONTKNOW- " even galut we must keep the mitzvot, such as not masterbating"
is that a mitzvah-getting reward for not doing it? or you get a Lav for doing it?

i have no idea. a rabbi can probably answer that alot better, maybe rabbi p.?

[Reu6922123]

DONTKNOW- " even galut we must keep the mitzvot, such as not masterbating"
is that a mitzvah-getting reward for not doing it? or you get a Lav for doing it?
Because were in gulus we get the Scar Mizvah for refraining. Every time somebody refrains from a avarah we get closer and closer to Moshiach's coming (IY"H Bkarov!)

[other]

Because were in gulus we get the Scar Mizvah for refraining. Every time somebody refrains from a avarah we get closer and closer to Moshiach's coming (IY"H Bkarov!)

I don't mean to be rude or blunt, but i think your talking about things that don't come into many of our minds and are not the angle we're looking from. We all know these things are wrong, theres no doubt in most of our minds about that, its just other ways we look at it that we doubt

[Reu6922123]

....and what angle whould that be?

I understood the replay but, explain "this angle" thing to me. We all take different routes but all end up in the same place, no?

[Reu6922123]

"By the way, I take masterbation over porn, for sure!! (Only a person in galus)"

Rue6922123 wat r u trying to say???
That G-d willingly we have these problems because of galus and when Moshiach comes we will be saved from things which bring us away from Hashem.

[WhoAmI]

which problems? masturbation or porn? and no one will have yetzer hara in times of mashiach? i dont know fully what will happen then, can you elaborate reu?

[lost33]

i dont think theres much f a diff between the underlying causes and reasons for one to masterbate or to look at porn while mastebating is prob wrse they both stem fomr the same problem the lack of control and the giving into our animilsitc sides, allowing our yetzer hara to overcome us

[other]

....and what angle whould that be?

I understood the replay but, explain "this angle" thing to me. We all take different routes but all end up in the same place, no?

I think a lot of us here know that halachicly masterbating is wrong, no question, i think the only thing we question is do we care. And is it wrong from other perspectives.

[Blink]

yea giving in to our sexual desires

[Reu6922123]

which problems? masturbation or porn? and no one will have yetzer hara in times of mashiach? i dont know fully what will happen then, can you elaborate reu?
B"H
Both Masterbation and porn are forbiden and a person recives the transgretion of a positive and negative commandments. Masterbation because of Zerah Lvatalah (releasing sperm invane) and porn because of what it says in the third paragraph of Shemah, "...and not explore after your heart and after your eyes after which you stray." Porn also brings on the avarah of Zerah L'Vatalh.

One of the many parts (war of Og and Mgog, Eliyahu HaNavi, eating of Levenyasin, Mechay Hamasim [rising of the dead] and the coming) of moshiach, will be the slautoring of the Angel of Death/Yaser Hara. When the Yesar Hara is dead so is the will of sin. People will be so (may I say?) stupified by Moshiach that no one will have the wanting to distant him self from Hashem's light (i.e. do avaros).

Do to the Seder of events to fully elaborate is not possiable here in this buletin board to explain. But, look in Rambam and you can get a good idea. By the way our Chachmim are not 100% sure of the the exact details of Moshiach till he comes B'Karov!!

Hope this anwsered you question, if not write back and I feel honored to be able to explain as much as I can. To trully understand (or the wanting to understand) brings the coming of Moshach quicker and quicker. Its time to leave Gulus already!! Kol Tuv

[Reu6922123]

I think a lot of us here know that halachicly masterbating is wrong, no question, i think the only thing we question is do we care. And is it wrong from other perspectives.

No, all jews (being Dan Lkaf Zucus) care about a averah. Its how much they work on their self-control. I myself understand the war you have to fight with this problem . Most times the Yesar Harah wins. What can I do. I try, learn Mesilis Yesharim and have Emunah (thats the caring part).

The Rambam was once summend to a king. The king heard that the Rambam told his students a person can still live with only a R'evis blood in heart. So the Rambam explained to the king that it is a lesson for a Yid and emunah. If a Jew has a once emunah and a Rason (will) he can go higher and higher in his avodas Hashem.

Don't get me wronge, I make these and many other mistakes to but saying openly "I dont care" is the same as not having a R'evis of blood left and R"L dying!!

Ani Katan B'Socha
Kol Tov

[other]

[QUOTE=Reu6922123]No, all jews (being Dan Lkaf Zucus) care about a averah. Its how much they work on their self-control.
[QUOTE]

You keep living with that idea.

[WhoAmI]

every1 has a conscience/yetzer tov telling them what to do. its just whether or not they listen to it and tetzer hara takes control.

[PrUnE]

yes the yetzer tov is tellin me what to do, im not just makin a desicion with my own free will keep tellin urself that, and Reu I couldnt give a s**t when i eat non kosher.

[lost33]

prune if u want to make a strong argument for ur opinions bashing judaism will get u no where and it only upsets and hurts those of us who choose to bleive in our heritage and our God.

[other]

every1 has a conscience/yetzer tov telling them what to do. its just whether or not they listen to it and tetzer hara takes control.

Yes, everyone has a yetzer tov and yetzer hara (better known as a conscious), but the thoughts that go into both of those things aren't necessarily hallaichicly based

[other]

prune if u want to make a strong argument for ur opinions bashing judaism will get u no where and it only upsets and hurts those of us who choose to bleive in our heritage and our God.

Why won't it get him anywhere? Its better that someone just follows if he doesn’t believe? How can someone live their whole life going through motions if they don't believe? It doesn’t hurt me that he feels that way, I’d rather he explore everything and come to or not come to it on his own.

[lost33]

read what i wrote other i meant that if he wanted to make a strong argument for his own opinions bashing judasim will get him no where, ad hominem attacks are useless and only weaken ur argument

[WhoAmI]

ui actually didnt think it was such an attack.. it told us how he felt, no harm done, so lets not assume the worst-- but yea i dont think the yetzers tov and ra are always teeling u whats wrong and right halachically... those are different guidelines

[pongo]

ok, so im a girl, and i knwo this topic is mostly a guys sorta thing to talk about, but i dont see whats wrong w/ either of them. its a normal & healthy thing for guys (and girls) to do. I think the reason ppl address this topic as such a HUGE sin, is b/c it is considered a taboo by our culture. We do plenty of sins every day (lashon hara) and no one makes a big deal. This is something that trully hurts no one. If it bothers you then try to stop, but otherwise... why not? go ahead

[2face78]

do u do it? if so is it possible that u are just making up an excuse bc u feel guilty urself?
IM OUT

[Dontknow]

do u do it? if so is it possible that u are just making up an excuse bc u feel guilty urself?
IM OUT

pongo sed she is a girl. Last i checked, female masterbation was permitted in this religion, therefor she has no reason to feel guilty and even if she did this prob wouldnt help make her guilt feel better cuz they dont match.

[2face78]

pongo sed she is a girl. Last i checked, female masterbation was permitted in this religion, therefor she has no reason to feel guilty and even if she did this prob wouldnt help make her guilt feel better cuz they dont match.
i no its not assur but pple still feel guilty bc its a taboo thing. btw its taboo throughout even american culture. something is taboo when kids dont want their parents to knwo they are doing it. like drinking as a minor, marijuana, smoking, masterbation ect.
IM OUT

[Dontknow]

i no its not assur but pple still feel guilty bc its a taboo thing. btw its taboo throughout even american culture. something is taboo when kids dont want their parents to knwo they are doing it. like drinking as a minor, marijuana, smoking, masterbation ect.
IM OUT

thats not the only way something is taboo... in america, female masterbation is not so taboo as u think. there are things on the market for women to use... just cuz a girl doesnt talk to her parents about it doesnt make it taboo. i dont tell my parents about every little thing i do, that doesnt make it taboo.

[2face78]

thats not the only way something is taboo... in america, female masterbation is not so taboo as u think. there are things on the market for women to use... just cuz a girl doesnt talk to her parents about it doesnt make it taboo. i dont tell my parents about every little thing i do, that doesnt make it taboo.gimme a good example of something-and items to buy on the market making something not taboo is bulls**t. there are things on the market for every imaginable taboo in the world- porn is a great example.
IM OUT

[WhoAmI]

I think those are some of the ways most taboos are formed. things people do, but dont discuss in public. thats what sites like this are for---taboos arent only not accpted by society as a whole, but tend to be considered bad even by individuals doing them.
porn is a taboo, not just b/c kids dont talk about it with adults, but because it causes guilt, and degrading to humans to be doing these things, i feel guilty after looking at porn and that why it's something taboo. if it were too accepted, and too open, everyone would just be criticizing each other for doing it.

[Dontknow]

gimme a good example of something-and items to buy on the market making something not taboo is bulls***. there are things on the market for every imaginable taboo in the world- porn is a great example.
IM OUT
thats just it! its all public- its all on the market. who has sex with who is no longer just btwn those two ppl. masterbation, i mean come on sexual novelty items? it once was taboo and maybe in the jewish world maybe it still is, but out there in the secular world, this stuff isnt taboo anymore. just like homosexuality, ppl would be homosexual, they just wouldnt talk about it cuz it was taboo. al of a sudden, its no longer taboo! everyone comes out- its ok to be gay. (my point here isnt, is it or is it not ok to be gay, but rather that once it was taboo and now its not, just like all the stuff we are talking about now).

[lost33]

well obviously modern society has no inhibtons, has no boundaries evryhting nowadays is instant gratification

[2face78]

thats just it! its all public- its all on the market. who has sex with who is no longer just btwn those two ppl. masterbation, i mean come on sexual novelty items? it once was taboo and maybe in the jewish world maybe it still is, but out there in the secular world, this stuff isnt taboo anymore. just like homosexuality, ppl would be homosexual, they just wouldnt talk about it cuz it was taboo. al of a sudden, its no longer taboo! everyone comes out- its ok to be gay. (my point here isnt, is it or is it not ok to be gay, but rather that once it was taboo and now its not, just like all the stuff we are talking about now).i still disagree with u. would u be comfortable telling the average person on the street that u masterbate. no chance. being gay and acting gay are different and one of them is taboo. its the differance between will and that other flamboyantly homosexual dude on will and grace. will is gay and the rxn to him is ok so wat. the reaction to that other guy is uch ur a flamboyant homosexual dont touch me.
thats the bottum line
IM OUT

[Dontknow]

would i be comfortable? no. but some ppl are. taboo is defined as a ban from a social custom. these customs are no longer banned... ppl talk about them more and more.

[2face78]

would i be comfortable? no. but some ppl are. taboo is defined as a ban from a social custom. these customs are no longer banned... ppl talk about them more and more.
the question is most-would most pple be uncomfortable around a guy like jack-the answer is yes thus its taboo
IM OUT

[WhoAmI]

the question is most-would most pple be uncomfortable around a guy like jack-the answer is yes thus its taboo
IM OUT

UMMM, WHO EXACTLY DEFINED THE ANSWER AS YES? OTHER THAN YOU, AND IT SEEMS LIKE YOU TEND TO BE HOMOPHOBIC

[elbubbniaevili]

It all comes down to this What is your personal view and belief? Also how religious you are in following the laws.
No one can tell you what to think, feel, or do.
Ultimately it is your decision and yours alone.

[Some1Else]

thats just it! its all public- its all on the market. who has sex with who is no longer just btwn those two ppl. masterbation, i mean come on sexual novelty items? it once was taboo and maybe in the jewish world maybe it still is, but out there in the secular world, this stuff isnt taboo anymore. just like homosexuality, ppl would be homosexual, they just wouldnt talk about it cuz it was taboo. al of a sudden, its no longer taboo! everyone comes out- its ok to be gay. (my point here isnt, is it or is it not ok to be gay, but rather that once it was taboo and now its not, just like all the stuff we are talking about now).speaking of sexual novelty items, whats everones oppion about them? Do people buy them? Is it ok? I have one friend who i know got one for her bday and another freind (olny a friend) who wants me to get her one (my parents wouldn't catch me buying it and then once she has it she can hide it). Anyone see anthing bad about that?

[Dontknow]

the question is most-would most pple be uncomfortable around a guy like jack-the answer is yes thus its taboo
IM OUT

i dont think i would feel so uncofortable aroud jack. I am a very accepting person.

[2face78]

i dont think i would feel so uncofortable aroud jack. I am a very accepting person.
obviously there is the rare case where someone would not feel uncomfortable-but in truth i highly doubt that u would feel completely normal. in the back of ur mind u would define him by his gayness.
IM OUT

[Dontknow]

obviously there is the rare case where someone would not feel uncomfortable-but in truth i highly doubt that u would feel completely normal. in the back of ur mind u would define him by his gayness.
IM OUT

i dont define ppl b their sexuality. and that doesnt make it taboo even if some ppl do. in todays world its ok to be gay and its ok to have a sexual novelty item and talk about masterbating. do i agree? no. thats a diferent story though. Ppl talk about these things, they arent off limits. maybe in the jewish world they are...

some1else- i think sexual novelty items are weird...

[other]

obviously there is the rare case where someone would not feel uncomfortable-but in truth i highly doubt that u would feel completely normal. in the back of ur mind u would define him by his gayness.
IM OUT

The sad part is that it even though it should not be rare that people are uncomfortable around someone who is gay, it isn’t very rare. Americans are so fixated on sexuality and never start thinking with their brain and stop thinking with their.... In a country where there are so many different types of people which so far all seem to get along, why should gayness be any different. (along those lines notice how in NYC, and the northeast in general people as a whole are far more accepting of gay people, while in the Midwest where everyone is a White Catholic. Also notice how teens in [private] schools where basically everyone is upper-class white)

Before i moved last year i had lived next to a gay couple my entire life. They were just as normal as anyone else. in fact nicer than other people sometimes. They never bothered me.

People are afraid that gay people act on their sexuality 24/7, they don't (of course there are those who do, but there are straight people who do also)

[2face78]

i dont disagree with wat u wish to be the perfect society but its impossible and we are not talking about whether these pple should be accepted, all im saying is that since they arent makes it taboo. in fact thats the definition of taboo.
A ban or an inhibition resulting from social custom -thats from dictionary.com
the fact that its the social custom not to accept gays their sexuality is taboo. now them and their sexuality are different things. thats key however, if a person is flamboyantly gay then they are defined by their sexuality and are thus entirely taboo-like jack from will and grace
IM OUT

[WhoAmI]

the fact that its the social custom not to accept gays their sexuality is taboo. now them and their sexuality are different things. thats key however, if a person is flamboyantly gay then they are defined by their sexuality and are thus entirely taboo-like jack from will and grace
IM OUT

in what world is that the social custom? there are plenty of ways to live without defining someone based on their sexuality. meterosexuals clearly break the taboo of flamboyant=gay, and nowadays, as discussed in anouhter post, many guy are pretty boys and not manly men.

[2face78]

in what world is that the social custom? there are plenty of ways to live without defining someone based on their sexuality. meterosexuals clearly break the taboo of flamboyant=gay, and nowadays, as discussed in anouhter post, many guy are pretty boys and not manly men.
ur are correct in that notion but pple who are metro are often called gay. being a manly man in many cases in prefered. and wat world- umm how about the us of a. pple are defined by the way they act out their sexuality-hence flamboyantly gay pple are defined by their gayness but reg. pple who just happened ot be gay are not defined as such.
IM OUT

[WhoAmI]

not tru. people are defined by how the act. period. if they act flamboyantly gay, fine, if they act straight, fine, but it has nothing to do with their personal sexual preferences. its how they act in public, thats all

[2face78]

like u said-if u act flamboyant. remember-most pple are straight so someone acting as such would not stand out thus not be defined that way. pple are defined by the way they act which provides unique characteristics about them. acting flamboyantly gay is a unique thing therefore a defining characteristic
IM OUT

[WhoAmI]

defining characteristic, but not enough to classify the person as taboo and gay. anyone else comment? i think me and 2face are just goin back and forth here...