goth

[Confuzedinlimbo]

-some who know me might disagree, but that only means they don't know me well enough. I don't like labels but I do belive that "goth" is a culture, one which i readily subject myself to. my opinion on goth is that it's a culture that embraces the darker side of life and accepts the "abnormal."

-Meaning that there is beauty in everything even though you might not see it at first and that utter and compleate happiness is unacheivable, therefore to obtain balance you need to accept that there are certain facts about life that are grotesque. these facts should not be considered weird because they are still a part of life. being afraid of (for example), death and evil is stupid because it will always be there, so instead of acting like it's not there we need to learn all we can about them in order to conquer the problem.

-The black clothing and makeup i think is to express how the individual feels about the world around them, it's a form of self expression. the clothing doesnt mean that the person wants to hate everything, it just means that you don't need to wear light colors all the time in order to be happy. black is not an evil color, its just part of the color spectrum. death isnt horribble (even though it hurts the people you leave behind) its just the final destination of life. everything has a purpose and not all purposes are good; not all people has a happy ending.

other people might think that goth means 1) you hate the world and this is how you express anger 2)you want attention or 3) its a way to party

ok, that might be true for some people but i think that more defines the character traits of people who get into "gothism" (i dunno if thats a real word, but u all get what im saying right??), but not what gothism actually encompasses on the whole. all these thigs include accepting the darker side of life, the problrem is that they also shun the light which in my opionion isnt goth.

[PrUnE]

Thats not what goth is at all. Goths think there is NO beauty in life whatsoever. They don't except the "abnormal" They think the world is a terrible place, and always think about death, cause goths only look at the bad in the world never the good. Goth wear black because black represents death, which they want. I know many Goths dude, and all they do is talk about how bad the world is, listen to the most depperrseive music they can find, cut themselevs, and talk about about how everyone is being a "conformist" which means followin everyone even though goths are conformists with the black clothin.

[PrUnE]

Goths look at all the bad in the world, yet if there was no bad in the world what would be good? Goths just contradict themselves for being goth. When somethin bad happens to you, you shouldn't deal with it by being Goth, cause then u will never realize the good in the world, in a way im happy there is some bad in the world to make us realize what good is, and how much better the good becomes, badness is what makes us realize that we are humans and not gods.

[Comfortably Dumb]

I hate Goths. They're all just a bunch of MTV-generated attention seekers who cut their wrists, badly I might add, and listen to God-awful music. I blame the parents for sitting back and watching their child waste in this lifestyle. These people need a good visit from my old pal, Mr. Discipline.

[Confuzedinlimbo]

for starters, i'm looking forward to reading darkfairyeyes's response

prune-what i wrote is only one opinion. labels and genres are so debated and twisted that its hard to tell what it origionally was meant to be. (although i know that goth started with music). what many people tend to do it either twist something so that it has the same basic outline it started out with but means something compleatly different (ex: me saying that goth is something with balance while still having dark undertones). I really dont know many goths (except for the ones i meet on the internet) but i have read about it and decided that this is what being "goth" means to me, it's my inturpritation of what i've read. doubtless there's a lot of anger and depression but like i said, most peope think they have to be happy all the time when its an unrealistic goal.
but you are right. most goths just b**ch and moan about how crappy life is.
you said something i liked (ok, im about to go off on a whole diff. tangent now) "[they] talk about about how everyone is being a "conformist" which means followin everyone, even though goths are conformists with the black clothin." so many people do that and it drives me insane. it's conforming to the idea of non-conformity. by sociaty setting the rules for whats accepted they also set the rules for what is unaccepted. people take these rules, dress in black, be loud and angry and call that sticking it to the man and "society's idealistic veiws of perfection"(a quote from foamy - a toon from another website). people are so ignorant and say they want to stick it to the man when they dont even know enough about the man to make an educate decision.

ok, had to go on that rant and as a closing statment i have a question for comfortable dumb.

.....mr. dicipline...???

[PrUnE]

Well then you my freind aren't goth,, u make like to think it, but u arent.

[Comfortably Dumb]

Mr. Discipline would probably be a drill sergeant. Should whip you into shape nicely.

[Blink]

well we can learn from them how to deal with evil in this world, but leave their negative attitude out of it.

[PrUnE]

well we can learn from them how to deal with evil in this world, but leave their negative attitude out of it.hows that? They dont ddeal with evil at all.

[luckst4rs]

who gives a crap?

why does it matter how confuzed defines herself and goth? let goth be whatever you want it to be. i think it's stupid to try to define yourself.

let everyone just do what they want regardless of what the cultural meaning of goth is. let confuzed make it her own and do what she wants. blah blah conformist and nonconformist. i hate those words. get over it. image is overrated

[PrUnE]

who gives a crap?

why does it matter how confuzed defines herself and goth? let goth be whatever you want it to be. i think it's stupid to try to define yourself.

let everyone just do what they want regardless of what the cultural meaning of goth is. let confuzed make it her own and do what she wants. blah blah conformist and nonconformist. i hate those words. get over it. image is overratedlol What u said made no sense, let her define goth for herself? Hey i got an idea lets define every word for ourseleves so that when everyone speaks we will have no clue what anyone means.

Goth is a word lucky, u can't define it for urself, it actually means somethin why dont u go look it up, cause maybe now I dont think the word god means what it means anymore,, for now on god means a cup. Don't u see why she cant define goth the way she wants.

[luckst4rs]

blah blah

yea what i wrote was totally mest up. i was kinda tired and i meant to say something totally different.
i meant that if she likes to think she's goth and wants to define her gothness as a way of balancing beauty and pain then go ahead. i didn't mean she can make goth really mean spoon. i meant if being goth is a representation of beauty within the darkness. then cool go ahead.

[Confuzedinlimbo]

The word "Goth" covers a lot of ground and almost two millennia: from the marauding Germanic tribes of the second century, to pointy European cathedrals and haunting American literature, all the way to the "dark" fashion and music that still gets confused with devil worship.

The Gothic architecture that evolved in Europe between the 12th and 16th centuries--vaulted ceilings, gargoyles, pointed arches--did actually get its name from the Germanic tribes. Italian Renaissance writers apparently thought those cathedrals were ugly and chose to blame them on the barbarians who had done battle with the Roman Empire about a thousand years earlier.

But what better setting than a Gothic-style medieval castle for the dark, scary Gothic literature that developed much later, with the stories of Edgar Allan Poe, Mary Shelley's "Frankenstein" and "Dracula"?

Ghoulish encounters with vampires and other living dead gave the characters of Gothic literature a bad case of anti-social behavior--a stigma (or sign of prestige) that endures in modern Goth culture: moody, punk-inspired music, first presented by Siouxsie & The Banshees and Bauhaus, and the black-and-white death tones of Goth fashion.

One of the latest blows to the Goth reputation followed the Columbine High School shootings in 1999; the killers were reported to have worn dark trench coats and listened to angsty rocker Marilyn Manson. Wrongly perceived as Goth, they were explained away as worshippers of evil--and members of the Goth community weren't pleased.

i copied this from a definition on another site.

also, goth isnt a word you define just like god isnt a word you define. if you think the cup is god...you might be a bit insane...but the only good explination for god is that he either omnipotent or a worshipped being with supernatural powers (i got that from the dictionary). so go ahead and think the cup is god.
anyways, back on goth. for the most part, goth culture is dark and more bizzare. goths dont nessacarily hate the world, or try to fix it like i suggested. person defines the underlying rule to fit ourselvs.

[PrUnE]

also, goth isnt a word you define just like god isnt a word you define. if you think the cup is god...you might be a bit insane...but the only good explination for god is that he either omnipotent or a worshipped being with supernatural powers (i got that from the dictionary). so go ahead and think the cup is god.
anyways, back on goth. for the most part, goth culture is dark and more bizzare. goths dont nessacarily hate the world, or try to fix it like i suggested. person defines the underlying rule to fit ourselvs.You totally misunderstood what I said, i wasnt sayin i think that god is a cup, i was sayin redefing the word, like sayin 1 is not one thing 1 means five things, or Talk doesnt mean speakin it means 7. now get what I am sayin?

[darkfairyeyes]

I hate Goths. They're all just a bunch of MTV-generated attention seekers who cut their wrists, badly I might add, and listen to God-awful music. I blame the parents for sitting back and watching their child waste in this lifestyle. These people need a good visit from my old pal, Mr. Discipline.How dare you Comfortably dumb. How f***ing dare you. You hate goths? I;m goth. Hell, I'm about as goth as they come. And you know what? I don't want attention. I just want to be left the **** alone. I never asked the world to hate me for expressing myself. I never asked for any of that. they made me feel like ****. I slit my wrists because of people who make the comments that you made. You hate them? You hate us? You hate me? You don't even know me. I've just recently stopped cutting and I am so happy that I did. And news flash. Preppy people cut themselves too. Don't blaim my mother and father. They are great people. This was my choice. This is what I want for me. I can't believe it. I am so I don't even know what to say. How the hell could you say that about them? About us? About me? I want an apology and I want it right now. And if I don't get one well then you, my dear friend, and I are going to have a very long chat so I can change your views on my people. My friends. My life. ME!
-----thank you confused. i needed to get that out.

[kiyara]

um, chill. why do u take so personally what someone says on a website?

[darkfairyeyes]

Because that cut me deeper than any knife I've ever used on myself.

[PrUnE]

How dare you Comfortably dumb. How f***ing dare you. You hate goths? I;m goth. Hell, I'm about as goth as they come. And you know what? I don't want attention. I just want to be left the **** alone. I never asked the world to hate me for expressing myself. I never asked for any of that. they made me feel like ****. I slit my wrists because of people who make the comments that you made. You hate them? You hate us? You hate me? You don't even know me. I've just recently stopped cutting and I am so happy that I did. And news flash. Preppy people cut themselves too. Don't blaim my mother and father. They are great people. This was my choice. This is what I want for me. I can't believe it. I am so I don't even know what to say. How the hell could you say that about them? About us? About me? I want an apology and I want it right now. And if I don't get one well then you, my dear friend, and I are going to have a very long chat so I can change your views on my people. My friends. My life. ME!
-----thank you confused. i needed to get that out.
Life treats you s***ty? My mom was murdered when I was 10, I didn't even get to say good-bye, the last thing I said was, "I'll cya later" did I? NO, you know how much that hurts me? i think it hurts alot more then anything thats happened to you, in ur life, but u dont see me takin out by being goth, dressin in black, sayin the world sucks, cuttin myself do you?

[kiyara]

how nice an cliche. listen. i dont mean to be mean, but if ur alreayd associating yourself with a certain group (goth) then be comfortable with who you are and how you are.

[darkfairyeyes]

Who says Im not comfortable? What do you who I am? And what do you mean how I am? Me as a person? Me as a goth? Or how and who goths are in general? Because to be honest I don't think you really understand what goth is. Unless of course you are goth and you've felt this deeper feeling to life. Gothic people are beautiful. We look at the world with such poetry and desire but we understand that to every apple is a poison. They arn't all so sweet. There is hardly such a thing as the perfect apple. So we decide to just be an apple. Neither sweet, poison or fair. We see the world as no others do as no others can. We just have a poetic sence to the world. We wish the rest of you did as well.

[Confuzedinlimbo]

depressed doesnt equal goth. and comfortable is allowed to express his opinion. you shoud tell him your views on what goth means to you instead of critisizing him with anger like u normally do

[darkfairyeyes]

I did just explain how I feel about goth. Hence what I just put up. Maybe you didn't read that. And what do you mean like I normally do? He said something highly offensive. And why did you want to see my responce to all of this anyway? You know how offended I get because of my views on this topic. If it was just to eat up my personality then that was really wrong. I never said he wasn't allowed to express his opinion. I'm just saying that he was being nieve and ignorant. Sorry, but I had to get that out I'm allowed to respond and express my opinion as well.

[Confuzedinlimbo]

he didnt say something offesive, he ws expressing his idea, as ugnorant as it was.
im just saying you wont convince anybody about ur views if you present them in an angry way.
i wanted to see what you would say not because i wanted to "eat up ur personality" as you seem to think the whole world wants to do, but beaus i know you feel strongly about this topic and i thought you might have something interesting to say.

[shufleye]

guys, TheLockers.net is a place to address issues that can't typically be spoken about openly in the jewish community, and its a place for teens to help other teens. reading this thread, i think some members have really lost sight of all that.

its pretty sad to see members who have shown such incredible support of each other - some of u for a long time now -- suddenly start going for eachothers throats when all confusedinlimbo wanted to do was open a discussion on a form of cultural experession thats important to him/her.

darkfairyeyes, i don't think anyone's attacking you -- goth is not 'you', and hopefully u are much more than 'goth'. if goth is so personal to u, rather than attacking people for being casual in their attitudes to it u can explain to us why some people feel so serious about it -- clearly some members don't really relate.

PrUnE, while no-one would deminish the unfathomable pain of your loss, its also not really fair to invalidate someone elses pain by turning hurt into a competition. we all have our tolerance level -- some people have a different threshhold but still need to come here for help.

let me ask u guys something -- overall, it is pretty clear that people feel intense about the goth thing whether they are the ones who do it or the ones who don't. why?

i mean, there are threads here about life, death, sex, and God that people dont' get so intense about -- and now suddenly there's a discussion about a lifestyle and things heat up in 2 seconds on both sides of it!!

why? is it goth specifically? is it the importance of fashion? is it the hunger for individuallity? is it resentment of individualism by people on the outside? why is this topic so intense?

~shufleye

[darkfairyeyes]

I think it's all of that. I think that there is a lot of passion in this topic because goth is a group of people that are generally looked down upon by society. Gothic people scare a lot of people. A lot of goths arn't nice but people have a tendincy to look down on them and -put them under a microscope more than others. We are jews. that's something that ALL of us can understand. I'm sorry for getting defensive but as you said this is something that we are all passionate about. I don't know how or why we are from both sides but we are.

[luckst4rs]

hell yea R. Shu!

sorry i just think what you said was exactly what i feel when i read all the posts where people attack each other on the forums. i mean yea it's always good to provoke a little argument into making people think about these issues brought up but i think bring in personal experience will never make anyone understand. when one person says "i have it really badly" the other assumes no one can have it worse than them and they launch back with an attack. everyone, for some reason i don't understand, wants to be the one worse off and get all the sympathy. no one can measure one persons happiness to another because as cheesy as it is you really need to walk a mile in someone else's shoes to get it. obviously some people are luckier than others, with a roof over their heads, a loving family, and everything but sometimes they can still be miserable. so just i think we should try to not bring up personal stuff to show how much one person can deserve to scream "i know pain" over the other. i think we should bring up situations like that when asking for advice or if you wanna tell a story but not to make someone else feel like their depression shouldn't exist. of course when you bring up things like goth or punk or preppy or whatever your gonna gt some shouting because when something becomes a huge mainstream thing thats got everyone screaming poser! then of course you'll have people yelling. just its sad to see one person defining the right or the right not to cut and be depressed.

darkfairyeyes- good job on stop cutting. you are your own person and if you like the goth thing then coolness go ahead as long as it makes you happy and its not something that expresses your "woe is me" depression.

prune- it sucks that you have sufffered that kind of painful loss and your handling it in a way without cutting. just don't assume darkfairyeyes doesn't understand pain; maybe she had learned a hard lesson herself.

that's all. i think the lockers is a good idea to help people go through a hard time and dealing with their issues. i wish we could just try to support each other. that's all we have here in our anonymity (spelling?)

[DeliaDeLyon]

A lot of goths arn't nice but people have a tendincy to look down on them and -put them under a microscope more than others

I have no problem with goths. I have a lot of friends that are goth, some of them are dark and depressed, others arent. I dont think its fair, however, to blame people for putting them under a microscope. The fact is that the way they dress and portray themselves to the world makes them stand out so of course people are going to look at them more closely and skeptically than they would look at someone who just blends in. It seems to be a natural consequence of expressing any sort of individuality. I think that if youre going to portray yourself in that way however, you should be ready to tell other people "You dont like it? **** off, I dont really care!" We dont need to justify what believe in to other people, but we do need to defend our right to believe in it.

[darkfairyeyes]

Delia- The bottom line is that all groups feel like they are always being put under a microscope. goths are a minority and we have a tendincy to feel that way a lot. We know that we scare people with the way that we look and the way that we dress. I personally don't think that we stand out that much but I guess I would feel like that considering that I am a goth. I think major preppys stand out more than mainstream goths but as I said most of the people I am friends with are goth so I guess I'm just used to it. I have preppy friends too though and they are kind of scared as hell with me sometimes but I still love them just as much as my gothic friends. I love who i am and what I believe in and I don't need to defend my right to believe in it because it's who i am and who i always will be. We just need to be happy and comfortable with ourselves. that's all what matters in this world.

[PrUnE]

Well, I'm sorry for goin crazy it was just that once she said that, I acted on emotion, sorry, I should have taken a step back and been like just count to ten, start thinkin rantionly and realize that people have gone through bads things, not as bad as i have maybe, and maybe worse, but everyone takes bad things differently, and thbats the main point i should have realized.

[darkfairyeyes]

You have every right to go crazy. hell, I do it all the time. And you came to that conclusion in the end so that's all that matters.

[moo]

"go ahead as long as it makes you happy"
-luckst4rs

"We just need to be happy and comfortable with ourselves. that's all what matters in this world."
-darkfairyeyes

I'm not such a big fan of that idea. I think it leads to a lot, a lot, of misery. If you really think that all life is about is being happy and comfortable, then you're just asking to be miserable for large chunks of your life. You can't always be happy and comfortable. Situations arise, life takes over, and there are situations that you just have to put up with even though you're neither happy nor comfortable. If you think the whole point of life is not to feel that way, you're essentially forcing yourself to be utterly depressed whenever things don't go your way. How can you do that to yourself? I see that this happens to a lot of people on these boards.

There's more to life than happiness. Life has a purpose. It's a lot safer and less depressing to think about if what is happening now is fulfilling or going against the purpose of life, rather than is it making me happy. If you ask is it making me happy then the answer is either yes or no, 50% chance you're fine and 50% chance that you're missing "all that matters in this world." I don't like those odds. but if you don't think about it that way, if you think about the purpose, and whether whatever is going on is helping or hindering it, then that's something you can control, something you can contribute to, no matter what the answer is. If it's helping the purpose, then help sustain it. If it's not, then work against it or work to fix it. Either way, u're in control, and u can't lose or be depressed. both options give you strength and direction. Like I said, there's more to life than just being happy and comfortable.

[luckst4rs]

um sorry but that's overly pessimistic. i'm not saying it makes u happy in a sense that you should always expect to be happy. but if you can make a decision and live a lifestyle where your causing yourself to be miserable and depressed then thats not healthy. but if you can be content with yourself and lead a mostly happy life, with of course the difficulties naturally thrown your way, then congratulations thats amazing. i have drama and problems and **** but for the most part im a happy.. so yea even though you get disappointed i believe happiness is something to strive for.

[darkfairyeyes]

DIVORCED PARENTS SUCK
okay im better now. dont mind me. okay well i mean moo has a point. high expectations are just a total invitation for bad **** to happen to you. have low expectations and you'll never get dissapointed, right?
i sometimes wonder if im gonna make it. latley i havnt eben so sure. like i know that i blow things out of proportion but im still going crazy. ha now im not. wouldnt it be fun if i actually explained this post? have a good day

[moo]

Of course you shouldn't make yourself miserable,and happiness is something to work for, but not as an end in itself. It can't be your whole or only purpose. Happiness is important insofar as it helps you accomplish your purpose and the purpose of life in general. I mean that depends on what the purpose is, but that's a different discussion. If you agree with me that there is a purpoose to life, then personal happiness is not all that matters in this world. That's really more what darkfairyeyes was saying than you, luckst4rs, that happiness being comfortable is all that matters. Being goth makes darkfairy comfortable and happy so she does it. But if you really believe what you just wrote in your last post, dark, shouldn't you not be goth so you don't have high expectations?

But, darkfairy, i think your response is overly pessimistic, it's not what I was saying. What u said actually is something Calvin said once in Calvin and Hobbes. Not exactly where I'd look for a role model. I didn't say have low expectations. On the contrary, expect to fulfill G-d's purpose for the world, at least your small part of it. Those are great expectations. I also didn't say avoid being disappointed. You're going to feel disappointed at some point in life no matter what, no matter how low you set your expectations. You have to accept that and prepare yourself to deal. If a person realizes that there is more to life than whether I feel happy or disappointed, that everything that's going on is part of some mega-process to accomplish a goal, then everything, every emotion can be used for good. Even sadness.

My original point was dont' just do only whatever makes you happy, comfy, wtvr. Do what helps accomplish the purpose in life. If that's what you're doing, then even when u're sad u're happy, in a way, because u're using that sadness to further the goal of creation. So, just as an example, before becoming goth or doing goth stuff, don't just ask will it make me happy. ask urself "Is being and doing goth accomplishing my purpose, or G-d's purpose, in the world?"

[darkfairyeyes]

I happen to be an overly pessimistic person. However, right now I'm doing an exercise that a couple of my friends thought out for me. I have a homework assignment pad and at the top of it there is room to list three goals for the week. Instead of writing my goals I do my "positive thinking" for the week. Every week I'll have three new good things about myself. Today wasn't so hard because it was the first day and because it was my friends that came up with the three good things but next week I'm on my own to come up with it. I'm hoping it'll make me into a more positive person.

[luckst4rs]

whatever works for ya cool

[nicotineandbubblegum]

Well, I'm a hard core goth. I got the peircings, the hair, the clothing, the attitude and I have what most people think all goths have. For seven months I was doing fine. And then I started smoking. Well, I stopped. But now my arms are once again lined with cuts. Up and down my arms are these lines that I made myself. It stresses me out a little but I feel so complete when I do it. I am one of those scary goths you hear about in steriotypes.
Dark- You may think it's beautiful to be gothic. If you saw my arms you wouldn't.

[darkfairyeyes]

I don't need to see your arms. Most of mine may be faded but I have my own arms to look at. Gothic is beautiful. Preppy people cut too. All type of people do. And you are beautiful. I know you are. I don't know who you are but I can tell my how you write that you have a deeper meaning in life just like me. I know how much the cutting hurts and sucks but that isn't what makes a person goth or not. I'm gothic and I hardly ever cut and you are gothic and you do cut and my friend is gothic and she's never cut a day in her life. cutting doesn't need to do with gothicsm.

[luckst4rs]

WOW i thought you guys were the same person. i don't know why i just thought it was a multiple personality second name or something but i guess not. and if you are man that's sick

but anyways- yea dark cutting has nothing to with gothicness. and stop using it as an excuse.

[darkfairyeyes]

LOL, you thought me and nicotine were the same people? I don't know. i may know nictone but I dont think i do. hmm, nicotine does remind me of me. Wow, that's totally freaky.
I didn't say that goth had anything to do with gothicsm, that's why i said it didn't.
Way to read a post man

[kiyara]

not to attack you if u feel strongly with waht u call "goth". but it really kind of irks me when u have a label to it, and say how only the ppl who dress in black, wear heavy makeup, act purposely like loners for attention, and mutilate themselves because they are poutwardly depressed or mourning society or whatever, are the only ones that think deeply about life and purpose. its so sick....just be a regular person and stop bragging about the scars on ur arms...oh it makes u cool if u make urself bleed, because then u have something that gets ppl drawn to u, even if its out of fear!

[luckst4rs]

damn i really thought you were the same person. just if you look at ur posts they are similar.

[darkfairyeyes]

wow harsheness kiyara, that wasnt what i was saying at all i dont know about nicotine. do you think i only dress in black and that i only think gothic people are beautiful bc you are totally wrong if you do.
luck- that is seriously the funniest thing ever. but you're right, they are kind of similar. i mean you never know who you know on this sight. it would be so weird if nicotine was someone from my possy.

[luckst4rs]

you got a possy? i want a possy? can i join? we should have posses on this sight hahah

[darkfairyeyes]

We can be the interclique possy.....how gay is that

[luckst4rs]

interclique day!

[darkfairyeyes]

my school had one of those once when wwe were in like 8th grade lol

[kiyara]

i feel dumb here, but whats a possy?

[darkfairyeyes]

LoL, it's a clique

[moo]

Kiyara raised a good point. She said that goths are not the only ones that think deeply about life and purpose. You can think about important stuff and stand up for causes and believe things without cutting urself or dressing in black or spiking your hair or wearing one those (u'll excuse me, but ridiculous) chokers - so why do it? dark and i think nicotine say it makes them feel good? why? how? what's so great about it?

PS i called the chokers ridiculous cuz when u wear them it makes u look like a pitbull or something.

[darkfairyeyes]

i have a lot of pain in my life and when I ct myself I am controlling some of the pain I feel. It's this amazing power that I can't even explain. It sounds weird to an outsider but you shouldn't judge someone who cuts until you are that person. hell, you shouldn't judge anyone until you're that person.
lol moo I love chockers. thy're great for covering hickeys.

[PrUnE]

wait may i ask, why do goths wear dog chains? Does the dog chain help anything, cause in my opinion it doesnt, and why do they only wear black clothin? these are things they do for absoulty no reason.

[luckst4rs]

people are weird
they like different things
some may adopt the black and chains to "fit in" with the goth stereotype they want to have
beats me why though

[darkfairyeyes]

um actually that is a steriotype right there. Not all goths wear "dog chains". BTw they arnt dog chains they are just collars. Any goth who wears a dog chain is a poseur. And not all goths wear only black. I'll be honest, when I first was goth I wore only black but what am I wearing nowadays? Pink and aeropostale. Does that make me any less goth? No. It doesnt make me anything. I know most of the goths you see on tv will be wearing all black but I mean it's also a personal thing. I wrote this thing.....
I'm on the inside
I'm not how I look
You think you can read me
Like Im an open book
But I'm not really like this
I'm not really pink
I'm black on the inside
I'm just trying to hide.

[Comfortably Dumb]

Do any of you here even know where the whole Gothic culture originated from? The whole thing is pretty silly.

[PrUnE]

The goths in the old times were people that fought against the romans actually, they had nothing to do with the goths of today.

[darkfairyeyes]

Goth is also a type of Roman architecture. It's very dark and beautiful and that's how goth got it's style today.

[Comfortably Dumb]

Goth is also a type of Roman architecture. It's very dark and beautiful and that's how goth got it's style today.

No. Goth started from deviant Iron Maiden fans and a band called The Cure.

[darkfairyeyes]

um Goth has been around for over a century

[luckst4rs]

haha the Cure rocks!

[Comfortably Dumb]

Not your kind of Goth.

[thewisediviner]

-

-Meaning that there is beauty in everything even though you might not see it at first and that utter and compleate happiness is unacheivable, therefore to obtain balance you need to accept that there are certain facts about life that are grotesque. these facts should not be considered weird because they are still a part of life. being afraid of (for example), death and evil is stupid because it will always be there, so instead of acting like it's not there we need to learn all we can about them in order to conquer the problem.




i'm sorry, i just looked at this thread and i dont know how the whole conversation is going. i just want to tell you confused, we all acknowledge
these things. we all know that we may not all attain true happiness in this world. i dont consider all these facts weird because i understand that they are facts of life.

i dont need to to be part of a specific culture in order to understand this. being alive is enough to teach us that.

[Confuzedinlimbo]

devine-thanx for the input. I wrote that a loong time ago and I guess it was kind of stupid to say that I can inturpret goth how I want or even bring up the label goth at all. All I wanted to explain was one inturpretation of a form of self expression. You can say how a label or trend evolves but what "goth" really is, is open to personal inturpretation-thats an opinion.

[thewisediviner]

thats cool, just be who you want to be, man. you like goth? well rock on man.
the main thing is...we should all be well. :cool:

[thewisediviner]

who cares where goth comes from? so what if it has an intricate history or it came from deviant iron maiden fans and a band called the cure, as far as i see it, its a way of expressing oneself, i'm sure its good to know the exact history, but thats not the point.

we have ways of expressing ourselves, this is one form of doing that. i like to run around and scream at the top of my lungs in public when things get to pressurized for me, or wear clothes which might not be acceppted by the society i live in (i live in a very orthodox society, the whole black hat deal and everything). i'm not goth and dont dress black on black,thats not how i float my boat, but for someone else it may work to make them feel better about themselves.

there is a little problem though, if the goth starts harming him/herself, like cutting themself or drugs or what not, that is a different issue which must be addressed. maybe some parts of being a goth can cause a person to do that, but i'm not a goth and i cant say for sure. but if goth does realy come from a century ago the all this new stuff like cutting and drugs and what not have nothing really to do with goth at all.

so all you goths out there...rock on, just dont yourself or those around you.

sorryy about all that i just had to get that of my chest, i hope it'll help you too,

the main thing is...we should all be well.

[Comfortably Dumb]

Hey. I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class, especially since I rule.

[x______delusions]

frankly, i feel you're all ignorant.

[ReleaseThePain]

seriuosly. god is dead. judaism is seriously the worst thing to happen to you people. get out of those yeshivas! and by the way...why do you wait over 6 months to make a reply?

[Blink]

G-D dead? ......, if he was dead then how could you call him G-D? G-D creaed the idea of death, and it only belongs in a physical manifestation and G-d is spiritual so him dying does not make sence at all...
U probably know nothing of Judaism and are extremely bitter about some thing.